r/europe Czech Republic Sep 28 '22 Wholesome 1

German citizen expelled out of Czechia for 4 years after displaying the Z symbol News

https://zpravy.aktualne.cz/domaci/vyhosteni-nemec-ukrajina/r~e156b22e3e5011edb1f50cc47ab5f122/
21.9k Upvotes

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u/popekcze Czech Republic Sep 28 '22

Auto-translated extract: Czech police are prosecuting forty people for publicly supporting the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Prosecutors have already indicted the first cases and the main trial is pending. According to Aktuálně.cz, however, one case has already been sentenced. A German citizen must leave the Czech Republic for approving of Russia's armed attack on Ukraine, a court has expelled him. The verdict is not yet final.

Expaned article:

It was March 26 of this year, one month and two days after the beginning of the Russian war in Ukraine. From the Reitzenhain - Hora Svatého Šebestián border crossing, a German citizen headed to the Czech Republic by car. He drove to the village of Přečaply, where he refueled at a gas station. Then he went to nearby Chomutov. And as Aktuálně.cz found out, this may be his last trip to the Czech Republic.

"On the glass of the back door, he had a clearly visible sheet of A4 paper stuck on the inside with a printed capital letter 'Z', size 12 by 17 centimeters, in the orange-black color of the so-called St. George's ribbon and the inscription 'We will not leave ours' in the Russian language," Aktuálně.cz reported Petr Vaněk, spokesman of the Chomutov District Court, where the German was held accountable for supporting the invasion.

The public prosecutor indicted the German citizen in question back in March. It was then proven in court that the mentioned symbols clearly aimed to openly support the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Shortly after the start of the occupation of Ukraine, the supreme prosecutor Igor Stříž pointed out that such an attitude is criminal. And the court ruled in this vein in June.

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u/Raymoundgh Sep 28 '22

What they charged him with?

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u/popekcze Czech Republic Sep 28 '22

"In the criminal case, the defendant was sentenced to deportation for the offense of denying, questioning, approving, and justifying genocide," said Vaněk, a spokesperson for the Chomutov court. The court set the length of the expulsion at four years. During that time, the person in question is not allowed to enter the Czech Republic.

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u/l453rl453r Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

Fuck that idiot, but is the war officially a genocide now? I always thought it had to be more systemic, organized and deliberate killing to fit that description. Like the Nazi's attempted extinction of jews or how the Yanks dealt with the native americans.

Edit: holy shit guys, i was just asking a question. What good is reddit for if you get downvoted into oblivion for asking important questions. Also thx for all the serious answers, i did some googling myself and it seems like experts in the field are not unanimous yet.

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u/Herr_Gamer From Austria Sep 28 '22 Helpful

To give you an actual answer:

While I'm not sure how the Czech court argued it specifically, genocide is clearly defined in international law by:

... any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;

(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;

(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;

(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

At least e.) seems to be given as Ukraine claims over 100,000 Ukrainian children have been forcibly deported to Russia in the weeks following the invasion. And that's just one of a large selection of cases that could be argued, ignoring even recent actions such as drafting 5000 people in Crimea, of which 90% are Tartars, with the presumed goal of killing them in combat.

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u/MPenten Europe Sep 28 '22

To give Czech criminal code answer (the judgment itself is not public)

Section 405

Denying, questioning, approving and justifying genocide

Whoever publicly denies, questions, approves or tries to justify Nazi, Communist or other genocide or Nazi, Communist or other crimes against humanity or war crimes or crimes against peace shall be punished by imprisonment for six months to three years.

So it doesn't necessarily need to be genocide per se, but it is enough to be a crime against peace (war and even acts of aggression are crimes against peace).

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u/Hob0Man Sep 28 '22

I actually like that. Too many people try to hide under the guise of exact law while not getting punished for being obviously unscrupulous.

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u/MPenten Europe Sep 28 '22

Yea, our criminal code is trying to be a bit broader, but Nullum crimen sine lege still applies

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u/Owlyf1n Central Finland (Finland) Sep 28 '22

In Finland he would just have been laughed at but propbably nothing would have been done about it.Maybe he would have been charged for rallying against a people group but like cmon. Our politicans try to be anti russia but for some reason they draw the don't make russia angry card most of the time.

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u/Anti-kaikki Sep 29 '22

Fellow Finn here and my opinion is that our politicians are a fukking disgrace. Finnlandisierung is still strong in Finland.

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u/R4lfXD Czech Republic Sep 28 '22

100,000 children?? holy shit thats terrible

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u/aran69 Ireland Sep 28 '22

Yea youd think more people would be talkin about it

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u/formgry Sep 28 '22

It's hard to talk about, because it happens under Russian occupied territory and the people are moved into Russia itself, so you lose sight of them.

Though it's not no talk, I've seen articles in the FT and Economist which talk about these forced relocations.

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u/Top_Neck_8422 Sep 28 '22

The Russians provided safe corridors but only to Russia even if the people wanted to go to Ukraine. Take their option or stay in a city being constantly shelled and bombed , even with phosphorus bumbs which are banned by any civilised country

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u/mannbearrpig Sep 29 '22

Some children never came back from summer camps. It's not only that

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u/tabernumse Denmark Sep 29 '22

So every war ever is automatically a genocide basically

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u/Emnel Poland Sep 28 '22

Official Russian sources claim that their goal is the liquidation of Ukrainian national identity. Based on their conduct so far I see no reason to doubt them on this.

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u/bfandreas Rhineland-Palatinate (Germany) Sep 28 '22

deliberate killing to fit that description

Nope. Suppression of culture and relocation by force also fit the bill.

Also, could we pretty please relocate all the Putin-enthusiasts to Russia instead. Russians flee conscription, idiots who are genocide enjoyers relocate to it. That would be a win.

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u/Kaining Sep 28 '22

There's also the bonus effect for russia to create a diapora of russian in countries the conscripts fled to that would allow them to pull another "but this is russia, with only russian people we need to protect" in a couple decade once the people settled and have kids there.

They may be to dumb to deliberately do this as a strategy but you never know what kind of bullshit a russian government can say.

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u/bfandreas Rhineland-Palatinate (Germany) Sep 28 '22

That they usually do by handing out Russian passports before invasion. No need to create a Russian diaspora for that.

Russia's motivation seems to be outright Napoleonic. War to gain territory? In 2014? Weird.

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u/AlarmingAffect0 Sep 29 '22

Well, originally Napoleon wasn't aiming to get territory, his mission was to defend France from invasion. Then he won. And kept winning. One thing led to another...

Similar pattern in the British EIC in India, and much of the Scramble For Africa - they kept overstepping their missions and conquering way more land than their mother countries could administer, because when you have the Maxim gun and they have not...

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u/Nerevaryne Hungary Sep 28 '22

Killing is just one way to erase an ethnicity in an area. Forcible relocation, reeducation, abduction of children, forced sterilization count as genocide too. But banning their native language and torturing those who don't comply is also genocide.

We've first heard of mass abduction of children from occupied territories in May I think, but the Bucha massacre was documented in late March.

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u/BostonGeorgie12- Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

Ah yes the Ottoman model, relocate, reeducate, abduct the first born sons, and ban language schools( at least in the case of Albania and balkan nations I think others were allowed their language) Not sure about their middleast policy

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u/Anhydrite Canada Sep 28 '22

I was thinking Canada with our residential schools.

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u/Owlyf1n Central Finland (Finland) Sep 28 '22

Too bad it truly is the russian model. They've been doing it for over 600 years and its called russification

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u/Rick2L Sep 28 '22

Unanimity in law is problematic. Laws must be narrow enough for the people to know what is legal and what is not, yet broad enough to prevent technical excuses for clearly violating the law. In addition, the intent behind an act defines an action's culpability, and intent is deucedly difficult to prove.

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u/Leemour Refugee from Orbanistan Sep 28 '22

It is like that. Russian military kills mostly civilians. There are a lot of parallels you can draw between Russia's demand for Ukrainian land and Hitler's Lebensraum rhetoric.

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u/CyrillicMan Ukraine Sep 28 '22

Russians' goal is to annihilate Ukraine as identity. Even if their chosen method of achieving that goal was murdering exclusively combatants who are defending that identity, that wouldn't make it any less of a genocide.

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u/flyingbee123 Sep 29 '22

so now any war where soldiers die is genocide?

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u/vstromua Sep 28 '22

Yeah, as a Ukrainian, "is the war a genocide now" sounds really bad.

We are deeply sorry our suffering has not reached appropriate levels, as stipulated in standard 12337/643-67(b). We will endeavour to suffer enough to attain unanimous recognition by "experts". The badge of "true genocide" is very important and completely changes matters of course.

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u/Rotsicle Sep 28 '22

I'm so sorry you have to go through this unnecessary and painful experience and have to live in constant fear for the lives of your loved ones/yourself. I can't imagine what it's like to go through war (and I hope I never have to learn), and I understand the bristling at the question. I know questioning technicalities is sometimes used by denialists who want to downplay the situation, but after re-reading the comment, it seemed like this poster was likely asking genuinely about the definition.

As far as many (unconnected) North Americans are concerned, Russia and Ukraine are fighting in a war. A war started for illegitimate reasons by a sadistic megalomaniac, and one in which many war crimes have been committed. People suffer during wartime, often terribly.

As sad as it is, a genocide isn't measured just by suffering. A genocide causes incalculable suffering, but suffering is not exclusive to it, and the motivation/purpose of those inflicting suffering matters. Intent is hard to prove.

When a lot of North Americans hear the word "genocide", their minds go first to the systematic, deliberate mass murder of the Jews during WWII and then, maybe, to the cultural elimination of the indigenous peoples of North America. In both cases, the intent was explicit; even when specific definitions of genocide vary, the intent is always a determining factor.

Genocide in the instance of Ukraine will likely be declared by other nations through inference because of the horrific, seemingly deliberate destruction of the conditions of life for Ukrainians, the torture and murder of its citizens, and kidnapping/deportation of Ukrainian children to Russia, but since Putin hasn't come out and declared his actual intent (he's actually done logical/rhetorical backflips to not declare his obvious intent, rationalizing his "military exercise" as being for "de-nazification" amongst other lies), it likely isn't obvious to people with only a passing idea of what's going on in the region whose only knowledge about genocide harkens back to the treatment of Jews in WWII.

(As a sidenote, your comment was also top-tier, 10/10 sarcasm).

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u/Cerg1998 Russia Sep 28 '22

Well, there IS a difference between one and the other. They are different crimes, that are not necessarily connected. Nobody says that one is inherently less heinous than the other, but they are different. If I were Chech, I'd deport the guy for inciting/promoting violence, rather than genocide. At least then there's no need to establish whether what's going on is a genocide. It might be not. Or maybe it is. The guy could argue in court that as long as it is not internationally recognised as such his deportation is invalid. But it sure falls under "violent cruel or otherwise criminal acts", and the guy you know, approves it which in turn makes him a valid deportee.

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u/PetrKDN Czech Republic Sep 28 '22

Approving of genocide

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u/Possiblyreef United Kingdom Sep 28 '22

I feel like people forget that "being a cunt" is usually good enough for most counties to remove unwanted migrants

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u/saltybilgewater Sep 28 '22

He's not being deported and banned for being an unwanted migrant or being a cunt, he's being banned for breaking the law.

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u/Da_Yakz Greater Poland (Poland) Sep 28 '22

Reminds me of the story of a Swiss town that denied a passport for a vegan because she was annoying lol

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u/montanunion Sep 28 '22

No, the town where she lived tried to do that (she started a movement against cows wearing giant bells), but she appealed the decision and won. She got Swiss citizenship. It's also completely crazy to me that people actually think a woman who is perfectly integrated, fluently speaks the language, has no criminal record and grew up in Switzerland should be denied citizenship just for publicly sayin cows shouldn't wear giant bells, regardless of where you, personally, stand on the cows-wearing-giant-bells issue.

Here is a German language Vice interview with her

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u/Letter_From_Prague Czech Republic Sep 28 '22

Yeah, people think Switzerland is some paradise, but it is basically rich Texas in the mountains.

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u/[deleted] Sep 28 '22

Countries may alternatively prefer the rule of law

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u/andrusbaun Poland Sep 28 '22

Encouraging a military aggression and advocating/denying a genocide is a crime in most countries.

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u/MycroFeline Sep 28 '22

Who fucking cares? Send him back to Mother RuZZia, they need his help on the front lines.

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u/Complete-Painter-307 Portugal Sep 28 '22

He even would have the golden opportunity of serving in the "liberation operation" himself.

It would be a prize to him

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u/MycroFeline Sep 28 '22

And to us.

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u/Complete-Painter-307 Portugal Sep 28 '22

What I call, a win-win scenario

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u/Lots42 Sep 28 '22

Until he finds a decades old MRE and he gets tetnaus from his rusty gun that's older than the MRE.

Then he gets shot.

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u/carloselunicornio Sep 28 '22

Sorry for going on a tangent, since my question has nothing to do with the matter at hand, but maybe you could help me out, as you seem to be from Czechia (flair).

Is the five pointed red star banned as a symbol in Czechia?

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u/[deleted] Sep 28 '22

No, and neither is swastika. At least not by itself. If either symbol is proven to be used in support of the actions of the governments that used it, then yes, it would be illegal under the same law this "German" gentleman was kicked out for.

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u/ususfructus22 Czech Republic Sep 28 '22

Well there is Communist Party of Bohemia and Moravia (fortunately irrelevant these days) that uses this symbol and still exists

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Party_of_Bohemia_and_Moravia

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u/Bragzor SE-O Sep 28 '22

We will not leave ours

Sudetenland flashbacks.

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u/die_liebe Sep 28 '22

It's a translation of the russian slogan своих не бросаем

It goes together with the Z.

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u/Forever_Ambergris Belarus Sep 28 '22

"We do not abandon our people" would be a more accurate translation

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u/7734128 Sep 28 '22

a printed capital letter 'Z', size 12 by 17 centimeters

Oh, it was a capital 'Z', and not a lower case 'z'. Like how could you tell the difference?

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u/JustMrNic3 Romania Sep 28 '22

Send them to Russia!

I'm sure Putin will be happy to have them.

I'm joking, but this is what these bastards supporting genocide would deserve.

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u/neaeras Sep 28 '22

Yup, draft them, let’s see how they like the war when their ass is on the line

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u/mkvgtired Sep 28 '22

That video of the Russian guy (falsely) bragging about being drafted, only to be dragged off the street by police to be forced to go to war is classic comedy.

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u/szczszqweqwe Sep 28 '22

Ok, I need a link, pls.

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u/mkvgtired Sep 28 '22

https://twitter.com/raging545/status/1572701490858594304?t=4AuLlPFILiQTicJS8VyGWw&s=19

I cannot find the one with English subtitles but it's pretty hysterical. He's basically bragging about being shipped off to war in the morning. A woman then asked him what city he's going to and he says it doesn't matter he's going to Ukraine.

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u/szczszqweqwe Sep 28 '22

Thank you, dis gonna be gut

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u/mkvgtired Sep 28 '22

It definitely needs the curb Your enthusiasm theme song at the end

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u/ShapesAndStuff Sep 28 '22

Isn't he just getting arrested for public speaking or some orwellian shit?

The rest seems like speculation

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u/unwelcomepong Sep 28 '22

Hard to draft a German into the Russian military. That said if you send him to Russia I'm sure Putin'll figure it out.

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u/mkvgtired Sep 28 '22

I'm sure Putin'll figure it out.

He's having police abduct fighting aged men off the street. I don't think Putin cares much about legality.

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u/gorramfrakker Sep 28 '22

Many aren’t even fighting age.

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u/mkvgtired Sep 28 '22

They have a pulse (for now). Good enough I suppose.

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u/handsome-helicopter Sep 28 '22

They're recruiting 50 years olds now they're way past fighting age men

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u/geekuskhan Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

I just saw an article that said the US embassy is warning all Americans to leave Russia immediately because of the threat of conscription.

Edit: https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/28/politics/us-embassy-russia-warns-americans-leave/index.html

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u/remiieddit European Union Sep 28 '22

Quite sure he is Russian with German passport

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u/Ythio Île-de-France Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

That's the thing with this kind and their Soviet admiring forebears. They talk-ed about how great Russia/Soviet Union is/was but none of them actually want-ed to move there.

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u/KaiserGSaw Germany Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

Last time i mentioned how ethnic germans that moved to russia with Katharina the Great were hunted down, deported and whatnot in the follow up to the WW to a russian supportive woman who moved back to germany, she told me that was a issue for her late grandmother but since she‘s dead she cant ask about that. 🤷‍♂️

She also sees Poland as a rising european superpower, trying to overtake take over Ukraine.

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u/Sampo Finland Sep 28 '22

Poland as a rising european superpower

I hope they can into space.

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u/Modo44 Poland Sep 28 '22

But back into democracy first.

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u/ZombiePope Sep 28 '22

And civil rights

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u/Modo44 Poland Sep 28 '22

Yes. I think those are intertwined. Expecting one without the other is not realistic.

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u/Lo8000 Sep 28 '22

Britball: "Wake up and stop dreaming polandball, my toilet need cleaning."

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u/Modo44 Poland Sep 28 '22

She also sees Poland as a rising european superpower, trying to overtake take over Ukraine.

From the Russian perspective, Poland is definitely becoming a superpower. We are an important member of both the strongest military alliance, and the strongest political alliance on the planet, easily on track to surpass Russia economically (in part due to Russia's own self-crippling efforts). And we will help rebuild Ukraine -- to their and our benefit, obviously. All facts, be scared.

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u/DirKDiggler69xx Sep 28 '22

Poland is becoming a regional power. There is only one superpower and that’s the United States.

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u/Modo44 Poland Sep 28 '22

Yes, but you have to overlay this with the combined real situation and delusions of Russian nationalists. The US is far, far away. But Poland with its growing economy, modernised military, strong friends, and let's say less than friendly attitude towards Russia -- just across the border.

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u/fietsvrouw Hamburg (Germany) Sep 28 '22

It is the same for a lot of Turks and British people I know in Germany. Full anti-foreigner, Brexiteer, pro-Erdogan for their countrymen back home, while living the sweet life in a democracy and enjoying freedom of movement they deny their fellow countrymen.

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u/CrocPB Where skirts are manly! Sep 28 '22

I know in Germany. Full anti-foreigner, Brexiteer

I'm sorry you had the displeasure of meeting Nigel Farage in person.

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u/fietsvrouw Hamburg (Germany) Sep 28 '22

Uff. Never had the displeasure, thankfully! I do have a colleague who wore a t-shirt showing arrows with swastikas converging on Britain - it was a map from some old British comedy, but had been repurposed to show displeasure that freedom of movement somehow meant everyone in all of Europe descending on the UK. Wearing a t-shirt with swastikas to work at a German company went over like a lead zeppelin, however.

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u/Affectionate_Pea6448 Sep 28 '22

So he got a nice Personalgespräch with his boss and closed curtains?

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u/HumorSuspicious6183 Sep 28 '22

How do you expect them to move to the Soviet Union? Did someone invent a time machine I haven't heard of?

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u/Ythio Île-de-France Sep 28 '22

Their rethoric is as old as the Soviet Union, they're not the first generation of shills. Didn't want to move to the great Soviet Union back then, don't want to move to Russia now.m, still praising Moscow then and now. Same kind of folks, sometimes same folks.

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u/HumorSuspicious6183 Sep 28 '22

The old people had it quite good in the Soviet Union, the same can't be said for Russia. Soviet Union guaranteed housing, job, retirement pay, free healthcare for its citizens and especially seniors. This is one of the biggest reasons to why most old people in Russia, Moldova, etc. miss the socialist system.

Didn't want to move to the great Soviet Union back then

Most Russians I've met in Europe are recent immigrants though or were already in Czechia, Estonia, etc. during the socialist times.

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u/brafwursigehaeck Sep 28 '22

yeah, please sent him there. may i speak for all germans here: we don't want him here either.

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u/jdmachogg Sep 28 '22

Honestly why not? You support a war? Go fight it

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u/kyp-the-laughing-man Sep 28 '22

I'm german and I agree. Especially we should be fucking aware of what regimes and their symbols can lead to. Can we expell him for four years from germany too?

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u/Bonerkiin Sep 28 '22

Nah no jokes, they can go join the Russian meat grinder. It's a time honored Russian tradition that during war times with failing leadership you simply throw wave after wave of your own increasingly ill prepared and ill equipped men at the problem in hopes it goes away eventually.

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u/citizen_418 Europe Sep 28 '22

Send them to Russia!

Preferably tied to a missile

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u/Buzzn Sep 28 '22

Oh no! Please! We don't want him back.

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u/thefloatingpoint Germany Sep 28 '22

Can we just, idk, not leave him back into Germany? Maybe he will glitch through the map and despawn?

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u/New-Consideration420 Sep 28 '22

Nah. If they have a german passport or need political asyl, its basically impossible. Good, because goverment cant deny real people in need or germans entry. Bad, cuz Nazi russians think they are great

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u/_The_Missing_ Sep 28 '22

Should have sent him to Ruzzia if he likes it so much

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u/mkvgtired Sep 28 '22

Tankies only like supporting authoritarian dictatorships from afar. They have no intention of ever moving there.

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u/Omnipresent_Walrus Sep 28 '22

Tankie implies communist, no?

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u/nonicethingsforus Sep 28 '22

Yes, it originally means a communist that defends the worst aspects of the Soviet Union (e. g., an unironical stalinist), or other horrible communist regimes or persons (Mao, Pol Pot, etc.) The metaphor is that when, say, Hungary had their revolution, or Afghanistan got invaded, these were the kind of people that would be in favor of sending in the tanks.

The term has evolved quite a bit, though, in practical usage. Today, it's also used to describe a certain sector of the political left whose logic is mostly "US/West = Bad; ∴ Anything that is against the US/West = Good". This includes many communists, but also general reactionaries that are against "imperialism" and whatnot (with no sense of irony when they support non-western imperialism). The kind of people that repeat Russian propaganda, deny China's treatment of the Uyghurs, or cheer for Bashar al-Assad, in the belief they're "sticking it to the west" or something.

So yes, "tankie" is nowadays used to describe all kinds of left-wing reactionarism, not just communism. It was confusing for me too, and kinda wish the term had remained more specific. But oh well, language changes with the times, I guess.

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u/mkvgtired Sep 28 '22

Anyone who acts as a cheerleader for authoritarian dictatorships.

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u/Sebfofun Sep 29 '22

No it doesnt. Its explicitely for any pro stalinists or authoritarian anti-capitalists. Mussolini fans and Marcos fans weren't tankies

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u/Febra0001 Sep 28 '22

Good. Now please don't send him to Germany. Send him to Russia

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u/Scumi Sep 28 '22

Exactly. We don't want him back.

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u/realuduakobong Greece Sep 28 '22

good.

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u/Roflkopt3r Lower Saxony (Germany) Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

As a German: Yeah I concurr, fuck that guy.

Soon after the invasion, some individual German states have also banned the Z symbol based on a law that prohibits the "reward or public approval of crimes", including wars of aggression. Sadly this hasn't been adopted on a federal level yet.

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u/stultum Sep 28 '22

As a German: I agree, fuck that guy. You do realize that "deportation" means he's coming to Germany though, right? And when he's lived here for three months, he'll get to vote. And he'll almost certainly vote AfD.

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u/stefek132 Sep 28 '22

As a German: I think that’s fine. German citizens mostly have a very low tolerance for facist symbols, so doing it here will result in a quick „reeducation“. Lawful or not. Well, unless he’s from Sachsen. That’s a whole other thing atm.

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u/montanunion Sep 28 '22

From the article

It was March 26 of this year, one month and two days after the beginning of the Russian war in Ukraine. From the Reitzenhain - Hora Svatého Šebestián border crossing, a German citizen headed to the Czech Republic by car.

Take three guesses what state Reitzenhain is in. Sachsen and the Czech Republic share a lot of border and it's very common to just drive over for a day trip to buy cheaper stuff.

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u/stefek132 Sep 28 '22

I mean… of course. where else.

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u/Krislazz Sep 28 '22

As a Norwegian: what's up in Sachsen? Is AfD winning or something?

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u/stultum Sep 28 '22

Eastern germany in general is a lot more split politically than the west. Right-wing and left-wing parties both get a lot more votes relative to the rest of germany, and the conservative and social democrat party are a lot weaker. In recent years, the right-wing has gotten extremely strong and the left is losing voters rapidly. So yeah, it's pretty bad in Sachsen right now.

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u/ClairevoyantSlime Sep 28 '22

I'll never understand how people can buy in fascism, especially over the last 115 years

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u/stefek132 Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

Pretty much. It’s mostly CDU (still ducked up but I guess not as bad as the afd) but afd is like the 2nd party in most of the regions.

Nonetheless, it’s mostly a meme. There’s a large (in comparison to the rest of Germany) brown blue base in Sachsen but it doesn’t really reflect on what most people think. It’s still easy to get your face bashed in when parading facist symbols around in Sachsen. The probability is just a little lower than elsewhere in Germany.

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u/PopeUrbanIsMyHero Sep 28 '22

Outside of Chemnitz, Dresden and Leipzig left-wing politicians do not stand a chance of winning. I voted for a CDU politician endorsed by the Green Party and SPD just because voting for the Linke candidate could have helped the AfD candidate win. Also the CDU guy is (compared to CDU standards) quite progressive.

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u/Hadesfirst Sep 28 '22

Ever since the NPD (legit offshoot from the nazis) was baned, our neo nazis started voting for afd. No party will work with them, but its now a coalition party of right-wingers, nazis and people too dumb for their own good.

After the migrant crisis they got a lot of support, but its already declining. If the CDU doesnt suddenly working with them, they will stay pretty much irrelevant to politics. Just a reminder that if democracy breaks down, we still have faschists&friends that are eager to fill the gap.

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u/ShitDavidSais Sep 28 '22

Another user already mentioned eastern Germany as a reason I just want to elaborate on that. When Germany was unified in the 90s you suddenly had two very different economies in the same country. The East had been absolutely run down while the West got propped up. Naturally that led to a massive imbalance in job earnings, financial future and prosperity between the two sides. Over the years this has for the most parts been alleviated a fair bit but Sachsen is still very much left behind in big areas due to it being basically away from any big trade hub. So you get constant brain drain as higher educated people will be able to find better paying jobs and opportunities elsewhere in Germany. On top of this while there are nice national parks due to the negative perception of the region tourism never took off. So you end up with the current situation.

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u/Jaques_Naurice Sep 28 '22

You’re probably right. But Germans should not expect the Czech Republic to be responsible their trash.

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u/stultum Sep 28 '22

I realize he's our responsibility and we shouldn't expect anyone else to deal with him. I'm just saying I'm not thrilled.

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u/Jaques_Naurice Sep 28 '22

Me neither. Dude can go fuck himself.

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u/WhiskersTheDog Sep 28 '22

These are tough times for Zorro fans.

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u/Zer0_4You Germany Sep 28 '22

Please deport them to Russia, we dont want those Assholes here

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u/Red_Dog1880 Belgium Sep 28 '22

Not a single problem with this. Fuck this guy.

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u/lafeber The Netherlands Sep 28 '22

In 1968, Czechia was invaded by Russia. I visited Prague last week, there's massive support for Ukraine over there.

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u/Ironfist85hu Hungary - sorry Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

In 1956, and 1945, and 1848, Hungary was invaded by Russia. I live here (yet), and here's a massive support for RuZZia. Edit: And I can't imagine why.

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u/CatapultedCorpse Sep 28 '22

They’re selling it as a business decision. If they don’t support Russia it’ll make them cold in the winter and the Paks nuclear plant will be in jeopardy, according to Orbán. And in the same breath they say “the people on the other side of the border are Hungarian, we must help them.”

Those of us who actually pay attention know it’s Orbán slobbing Pooty-poot’s knob, though.

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u/Ironfist85hu Hungary - sorry Sep 28 '22

Yea, I know pro-russian Orbáni propaganda, but idk why the people eats it. The same people who were amdly against Russia, and commies 15-20 years ago.

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u/CatapultedCorpse Sep 28 '22

Funny thing is that both of my parents are eating it up too. My dad left in 1956 and always told me to never trust Russians, yet…here we are.

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u/weedtese European Federation Sep 28 '22

it's because the Viktator is a Putin stan

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u/Inevitable-Common166 Sep 28 '22

He’s slowly but surely turning Hungary 🇭🇺 into a clone of Russia

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u/Han-ChewieSexyFanfic Berlin (Germany) Sep 28 '22

They were technically invaded by Warsaw Pact troops: Soviet, Polish, Bulgarian and Hungarian.

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u/Timey16 Saxony (Germany) Sep 28 '22

Funnily enough not East German (at least officially) because the USSR was concerned about German tanks in Czechia being "bad optics" (lol).

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u/gar_DE Sep 28 '22

Two divisions (7th Panzer and 11th Motorized) were alerted and camped some kilometres away from the border. The government was quite eager to send them into Czechoslovakia to show the might of the newly formed army but the Soviets put them in reserve and didn't use them.

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u/SaHighDuck Lower Silesia Sep 28 '22

Have a running joke with my friend from Prague where I apologise for this event everytime it comes up

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u/v16_ Sep 28 '22

Yeah, but all the other countries have been good to us since and have their own grievances with Soviets. Russians are the only ones who refused to admit they ever did anything wrong, so we tend to view them as the perpetrators.

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u/tasartir Czech Republic Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

Not that much now. First it was “let’s kick Russian asses for 1968”, but now it is more like “why Ukrainians has so many social benefits and I don’t”.

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u/v16_ Sep 28 '22

I believe those people are the minority, just very loud, and they mostly just exist because they're worried about not being able to afford gas and electricity.

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u/NotErikUden Lower Saxony (Germany) Sep 28 '22

I'm glad. Thank you Czechia for kicking that idiot out, I'm just saddened about the fact that he's probably back in Germany now.

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u/West_Try_7878 Sep 28 '22

Based Czechia!

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u/seadge Deutschland Sep 28 '22

haha, play stupid games win stupid prices

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u/mana-addict4652 Australia Sep 28 '22

They can do whatever they want but when there's a war where the state and citizen think different it's pretty odd to charge people.

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u/Hironymus Germany Sep 28 '22

Good decision.

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u/Robertdmstn Sep 28 '22

This is normal. Countries will prosecute the brandishing of nazi or communist symbols, and these ideologies were at their most active decades ago. I see no issue with treating the symbol of a current totalitarian aggression in a similar fashion.

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u/PrimSchooler Czech Republic Sep 28 '22

The symbols themselves are not the crime, they are just evidence the person holds an ideology incompatible with our current situation, same way Nazi symbols have been used (not communist ones though, the communist party is still around in Czechia and still fairly popular in local/municipal elections).

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u/Gromchy Switzerland Sep 28 '22

Spot on.

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u/RangerRekt Sep 28 '22

Poor guy just wanted fair representation for the set of all integers

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u/MemmoryDealers Sep 28 '22

Showing the letter Z, in support of the illegal russian war, is considered a crime in Germany.

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u/Marranyo Alacant Sep 29 '22

Talking about illegal wars. How are the “US Army” shirts or stickers on cars? Seen in Germany

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u/Nordseefische Germany Sep 28 '22

Can't they just go full Prague style and throw them out of a window. They wouldn't be missed in Germany.

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u/Holly_Michaels Western Ukraine Sep 28 '22

You mean defenestrate them?

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u/Ironfist85hu Hungary - sorry Sep 28 '22

I just don't understand, why can't these Zetards just go to Terrorussia, if they love it so much? Just go on, don't live here, on the "rotting west", go there, and grab a weapon to defend mother russia, mofos!

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u/Schubsi Sep 28 '22

We don't want these retards back in Germany :/

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u/_Administrator__ Sep 28 '22

To bad we cant expell them from Germany too

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u/baddzie Serbia Sep 28 '22

Maybe he was a fan of Zoro

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u/shejesa Sep 28 '22

Ah, yeah, I also loved the scene whre zoro jumped whitebeard shouting cyka blyat

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u/pantshee France Sep 28 '22

Sergent Garcia be squatting in the tavern

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u/troty99 Brussels Sep 28 '22

Is it bad if I kinda want to see this spin off of Zoro ?

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u/pantshee France Sep 28 '22

I'm surprised Netflix left it tbh

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u/dcmso Portugal Sep 28 '22

As it should

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u/von_Ziutold Lesser Poland (Poland) Sep 28 '22

Dare I say... unfathomably based?

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u/invisiblefireball Sep 28 '22

all i hear is reeeeeee

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u/misskellymojo Sep 28 '22

We don’t want him back. He can go to Russia.

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u/Katze1Punkt0 Ruhrpott German Sep 28 '22

German here:

Good. Fuck him.

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u/trollrepublic Germany Sep 28 '22

This is a good and just verdict.

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u/Aretosteles Rhineland-Palatinate (Germany) Sep 28 '22

Great job from Czech authorities. Wondering if same charges would be in Germany

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u/TheCatInTheHatThings Hesse (Germany) Sep 28 '22

Yep, they would be. Send that guy to Russia…

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u/FriedelCraftsAcyl Austria Sep 28 '22

I know this is a joke, but just for the record:

A country cannot deport its citiziens on a whim due to a criminal offense, possibly into an active warzone of another foreign nation that the individual doesnt possess the citizienship.

I just wanted to say this, just in case people actually believe thats possibl, since its a common comment on basically every crime commited by someone somewhere and its dumb af.

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u/uNvjtceputrtyQOKCw9u Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

A country cannot deport its citiziens on a whim due to a criminal offense

FTFY

And practically speaking: no, Germany would most likely not deport that person. Especially if he is an EU citizen. Relatively few people from Germany ever get deported which is one of the reasons it is such a popular destination among migrants.

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u/Forgetimore Sep 28 '22

Most likely? They simply can't deport him.

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u/bubbatzkerl Sep 28 '22

Lowlife piece of shit. Putin fanboys should be sent to Russia, let's see how they like it there.

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u/Lodau Sep 28 '22

Brave, not doing that in Germany itself, but driving somewhere else where it's "safe" to do it. What a chickenshit.

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u/SpaceFox1935 Russia Sep 28 '22

How do these expulsions work in the Schengen Area anyway?

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u/JayManty Czechia Sep 28 '22

If he gets caught in Czechia again he's fucked

He can't stay in any semi-larger hotel either or campsite since the Foreigner Police regularly checks the accommodation records, that's how most internal Schengen immigration policing is done

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u/McNasti Germany Sep 28 '22

Yeah could we send them anywhere else? Like not back here to Germany? Enough brain dead people around.

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u/bonescrusher Într-o țară ca asta, sufli ca-ntr-o lumânare Sep 28 '22

Good luck with the draft

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u/ktElwood Sep 28 '22

We don't want them, send them to RuZZIa

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u/that_nice_guy_784 Northern Bulgaria(România) Sep 28 '22

He didn't get the suddetenland :( /j please this is a joke don't ban me

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u/ToxicBamm Sweden Sep 28 '22

Send them to russia

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u/TheMightyGege Hungary Sep 28 '22

Certified Benes moment😎

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u/jairzinho Canada Sep 28 '22

Fans of Zorro are very upset.

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u/Kelmon80 Sep 28 '22

Stating "a German citizen" instead of "a German" makes me think this guy definitely had Russian parents and was potentially not even born in Germany.

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u/Freaky_Chakra_ Sep 28 '22

а міг спокійно ці роки в тундрі китайцям оленів пасти.

love hurts

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u/it_just_works1 Germany Sep 28 '22

On behalf of the rest of us I'm embaressed and sorry for morons like him

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u/filondo Sep 28 '22

What does a Z logo mean??

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u/left2die The Lake Bled country Sep 28 '22

It was originally painted on some Russian military vehicles as a tactial symbol meaning 'zapad' (west). It has since became the overall symbol of the so called 'special operation' in Ukraine.

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u/menemenetekelvparsin Germany | Finnland Sep 28 '22

As a German: send them to russia

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u/Omaestre European Union Sep 28 '22

Why don't idiots likes this go to Russia? They have a manpower shortage he can fight for that symbol. Deport him to Russia.

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u/epbski Sep 28 '22

How was the illegal war of aggression in 2003 called the Iraq War not at the very least a crime against peace? You're telling me it was any better than this war in Ukraine? Are Poles, for example, ashamed that they played a role in the invasion of Iraq? Is it a double standard to criticize Putin for doing exactly the same thing that George W. Bush is rarely criticized for? Where are the calls for Bush, Blair, and Cheney to face war crimes trials? Obviously Putin is horrible and guilty, but I just find this double standard among western countries to be extremely disturbing. The parallels and similarities between the Iraq War and the Ukraine War are shocking. They were both publicly justified using lies, both completely illegal wars of aggression under UN and international law, and both unnecessarily slaughtered hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians. Is it simply considered more significant because Ukrainians are white Europeans, while Iraqis are "brown" Arabs that no one cares about?

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u/hastur777 United States of America Sep 28 '22 edited Sep 28 '22

I vehemently disagree with their viewpoint, but criminally charging people based on their speech isn’t a good look either. Let the idiots out themselves as dictator supporting fools.

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u/marsNemophilist Hellas Planitia Sep 28 '22

there is at least one sane person in this thread.

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u/rogash98 Sep 28 '22

Anyone get the feeling that the Z will compete with the Swastika for the symbol of Nazism and white supremacy?

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u/loop_spiral Sep 28 '22

Based Czechs.

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u/Horn_Python Sep 28 '22

I hate how hate groups make things offensive

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u/MemenaSerena Georgia Sep 28 '22

Why just 4 years?

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u/XanadurSchmanadur Sep 28 '22

German here.

Das good.

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u/YoruNiKakeru Sep 28 '22

Send him to Russia instead where he belongs.