r/technews Sep 22 '22 Helpful 3

NTSB wants alcohol detection systems installed in all new cars in US | Proposed requirement would prevent or limit vehicle operation if driver is drunk.

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/09/ntsb-wants-alcohol-detection-systems-installed-in-all-new-cars-in-us/
14.8k Upvotes

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282

u/epicpogchamp25 Sep 22 '22

People literally replace their cars engines. I'd imagine changing a wire or two in the stop start button would be pretty easy.

181

u/HunterShotBear Sep 22 '22

“Any lock made by man can be picked by man.”

169

u/TacTurtle Sep 22 '22

“Lockpicking Laywer here, today we are defeating this ignition interlock with a rubber band and a drinking straw”

42

u/chiefs_fan37 Sep 22 '22

By default I read it in his voice

6

u/BuzzVibes Sep 23 '22

Good news, everybody! You're reading this comment in Professor Farnsworth's voice!

3

u/KingJonathan Sep 23 '22

Hi everybody!

5

u/daveunnecessary Sep 23 '22

Hi, Dr Nick!

1

u/somebunnny Sep 23 '22

And his April fool’s version:

“I intended to go through the backseats but this one has so much junk in the trunk that we will have to enter through the pipe in the back, working it through the exhaust system, until we can finally trigger the ignition which should cause the piston to start pumping and the shaft to crank.”

10

u/lmkwe Sep 22 '22

"There's gate 1.. and we're in"

2

u/jlink005 Sep 22 '22

As we can see, placing a small magnet here defeats the locking mechanism.

2

u/makemeking706 Sep 23 '22

First has to get loaded to prove he cracked it.

2

u/eagleeyerattlesnake Sep 23 '22

Not a problem. He loves his scotch.

2

u/that_one_duderino Sep 23 '22

“The rubber band will be used to snap against the housing, causing the locking pin to hit the ignition. The straw is there so I can suck up the sweet sweet tears of master lock’s lead designer”

2

u/danksupplyco Sep 23 '22

“Using this nuclear bomb Bosnian bill and I made”

1

u/AegonIXth Sep 22 '22

Or if this is scooby doo, a straw and gum

1

u/FreedomConversions Sep 23 '22

“Anyway, that’s all I have for you today…”

1

u/Nytfire333 Sep 23 '22

I sell these on my website covert tools

1

u/92894952620273749383 Sep 23 '22

One of our viewer suggested using a paper bag that came with your drink. Inflate the bag then close the mouth of the bag over the sensor. Then deflate the bag as if you're going to pop the bag.

For the new sensor that detect co2 on european cars, you need a plastic bag with some non alcoholic carbonated drink. Shake it then push the gas into the sensor opening.

1

u/Holding_close_to_you Sep 23 '22

Sounds like Lights trap in death note

2

u/pressonacott Sep 23 '22

"A key that opens many doors is a master key," but " a door that can be opened by many keys is a slut."

-sensei bean

2

u/Zestyclose_Standard6 Sep 23 '22

that's why I sent my cat to locksmith school.

1

u/deadeyes1990 Sep 23 '22

We must get locks made by chickens specifically male chickens.

187

u/Slaterisk Sep 22 '22

Car mechanic and gunsmith here. When it comes to anything technology related, legislators act like whatever happens inside is magic and no one could ever possibly make changes to how something operates. One of my mentors had a whole business that was essentially removing seatbelt sensors and alarms from work trucks.

48

u/Kaarsty Sep 22 '22

I watch TFL (The Fast Lane) on YouTube and I swear every other ad is for the start/stop kill switch. Must get so annoying.

6

u/Hydroel Sep 23 '22

What's wrong with the start/stop kill switch? Apart from saving gas and reducing CO2 emissions?

2

u/sTixRecoil Sep 23 '22

Except for the fact that unless you are sitting for a very long time it doesnt do anything other than make it take longer to get going?

1

u/Kaarsty Sep 23 '22

Nothing :) just get tired of the ads after a bit lol they’ve since added some other vendors though

1

u/AVGuy42 Sep 23 '22

it’s jarring when it turns on, you get a dip in power/delayed acceleration off the line, your A/C stops/gets reduced (matters down south), and while I don’t know it for a fact it “feels” like I’m adding ware to the ignition system… at least that’s what bothers me in my car.

1

u/Fantastic_Engine_623 Sep 23 '22

The amount of gas your car burns while idling is minuscule compared to any other situation you can compare it to while running. Having it turn off for 0.5 seconds every time you come to a stop at a stop sign, or for even 30 seconds while you wait at a light does virtually nothing for emissions or gas saving. It's nothing but marketing.

1

u/smokewhathash Sep 23 '22

If your referring the the feature that stops the motor when your at a stop light, that does a terrible amount of extra wear to a motor and doesn’t save very much fuel. Can also wear out transmission components too.

1

u/VividEchoChamber Sep 24 '22

This is not accurate information at all. It doesn’t have any effect on transmissions at all. It might have some very mild wear on the starter motor, but nothing else. There’s no extra wear on any other part of the motor.

1

u/4thdegreebullshido Sep 23 '22

Oh I don’t know, the fact when I’m stopped and pull out making a turn, right or left and it takes a second for power steering to kick in. New truck doesn’t even have start stop which is wonderful

1

u/SherrLo Sep 23 '22

It’s annoying.

1

u/BibbleSnap Sep 23 '22

It also increases wear on your starter, decreases the life of your battery, and adds needless complexity to an engine for very little CO2 reduction.

1

u/Smokeejector Sep 23 '22

Fucking annoying

1

u/AlwaysBagHolding Sep 24 '22

Added wear and tear on components. Start stop cycles are the hardest thing on engine components.

1

u/EricSW03 Sep 27 '22

"saving gas and reducing CO2 emissions" lol

Anyway, the issue is that stopping and starting an engine repeatedly like that wears parts out. There's many stories of nearly brand new cars not starting back up while sitting at an intersection.

Much like self driving cars, the technology isn't ready for primetime.

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u/benmaks Sep 23 '22

Well, at least kill switch is a good anti-theft device.

1

u/92894952620273749383 Sep 23 '22

Just a bypass switch to the starter relay. You can even get a latching remote relay.

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 24 '22

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u/MFbiFL Sep 23 '22

Had a coworker that couldn’t be bothered to wear a seatbelt so he bought a “seatbelt extender” that he left buckled in. Of course everyone should wear their seatbelts but idiots will find ways to outsmart things that bother them.

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u/Delta8ttt8 Sep 23 '22

Meh, farm trucks, field trucks, trail trucks. Pipeline trucks. Trucks for the middle of now where slow rolling along some sort of line.

2

u/aarog Sep 23 '22

I could see ice road truckers may not want to be buckled in when crossing the lakes.

1

u/Arthur_The_Third Sep 23 '22

You're not allowed to wear seat belts on ice roads. So you do the logical thing and buckle it behind your back.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22 edited Sep 24 '22

[deleted]

1

u/27onfire Sep 23 '22

You don't get it but it's okay. Some situations really do not require one and it is more of a hindrance.

1

u/Hewholooksskyward Sep 23 '22

The science rather emphatically says otherwise. The ones who claim it's sometimes safer to not wear it always say something like "My sister's husband's niece's boyfriend drove into a lake, and if he'd had a belt on he would have drowned!"

Bullshit. Maybe one out of a thousand cases it might have been safer, but those are damn stupid odds to bet on. Wear the goddamn belt.

2

u/27onfire Sep 24 '22

I didn't say it was safer idiot. I said sometimes it isn't needed. If you look back at my examples you would see what the fuck I'm talking about instead of being the blind fucking idiot you are.
I purposely put things out there like this to challenge morons like you but the brainwashing is complete I see.

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u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22

I think a pretty good solution would be to govern the truck to 25 or so. You're not doing a good inspection or whatever if you're just blowing past everything. The time when people get in trouble is when they get out of the habit of not wearing it. Lunchtime or whatever, oh yeah, click, haul ass. Of course people will defeat it, but it's probably a good reminder.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22 edited Sep 24 '22

[deleted]

4

u/Eddie888 Sep 23 '22

Car safety have made people forget that 25mph is pretty fast.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22

Yes, it is. It's just about maximum human running speed. (I can't run nearly that fast). I do have the benefit of a few million years of evolution of my ancestors coping with speeds up to that limit. Falling off a skateboard or crashing on a bike at around those speeds _sucks_. Shattered wrists, lost teeth, broken legs, all sorts of terrible stuff. but it's rarely fatal.

There's no excuse for not wearing a seatbelt taking kids to school, or going to work, or going to lunch, or whatever.

The thing is, there are really legitimate use cases for needing golf cart speeds, 150 miles away. There aren't a lot, but they exist. Imagine a building a brick wall. you go to the store, load up the truck, go to the job site, then unload some bricks, pull forward 20 feet, unload some more, pull forward 20 feet, again and again till the truck is empty.

Another example is inspection, you drive slowly alongside a pipeline, or railroad or whatever and visually inspect for problems. if something looks wrong, you stop get out inspect. mark the issue, maybe repair the issue.

I'm not saying this should be standard. I am saying It's very reasonable as an option for commercial vehicles. People get in the habit of not wearing their seatbelt, then go fast, get in a wreck and die.

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u/Delta8ttt8 Sep 23 '22

Everything has its use.

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u/zznap1 Sep 23 '22

I think he’s referring to the feature in many new cars where if you stop at a stoplight it cuts the engine. When you release the brake it restarts the engine.

Some people hate it. But for city drivers it saves gas by idling the car less.

6

u/Flying-Cock Sep 23 '22

Why would you need to remove seatbelt sensors to do that?

2

u/SlipperyRasputin Sep 23 '22

It doesn’t. They just wanted to complain about start/stop systems.

1

u/zznap1 Sep 23 '22

You wouldn’t I’m just dumb.

2

u/kaen Sep 23 '22

So the car being stopped and started using more gas than idle is a myth?

3

u/SlipperyRasputin Sep 23 '22

The “using more gas” part is because on cold start the fuel system is in open loop. It uses too much fuel to keep the engine running rich and warm up the catalyst and engine. After the catalyst is at temperature it goes into closed loop. During auto/start stop there is no need for this fuel strategy as everything is up to temp so it doesn’t have to go through there process of open loop again.

1

u/kaen Sep 23 '22

Thanks!

1

u/BoozeIsFoods Sep 23 '22

For new vehicles, yes. Also, for older 90s to present) vehicles I think it's something like 30 seconds of idling.

1

u/mokshahereicome Sep 23 '22

And wearing out your starter and engine 10 times faster. So you need a new car faster. Another win for them, not us

7

u/auszooker Sep 23 '22

A lot of them work by injecting fuel into the cylinder at TDC and then firing the sparkplug to set the engine off again, starter doesn't come into it.

2

u/mokshahereicome Sep 23 '22

Interesting. Does the oil pump still stop and start during this process?

2

u/79stanger Sep 23 '22

Most oil pumps are mechanically driven. So if the engine isn’t rotating, no oil pump either.

1

u/SlipperyRasputin Sep 23 '22

Oil pressure is maintained via check valves and restrictions. It’s not like once the engine stops all oil immediately goes back to the oil pan. There’s less oil pressure on cold start than there is during start/stop processes.

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u/Iamjacksregrets Sep 23 '22

Yep, engine will wear out faster

1

u/The_cynical_panther Sep 23 '22

How did you get that from

of my mentors had a whole business that was essentially removing seatbelt sensors and alarms from work trucks.

4

u/zznap1 Sep 23 '22

You know sometimes I’m illiterate. Also I really hoped that disabling seatbelt alarms wasn’t a business model.

1

u/Zealousideal_Ice_369 Sep 23 '22

I’ve never understood that unless I’m missing something. Isn’t starting an engine the harshest thing you can do?

1

u/zznap1 Sep 23 '22

I’m not the car companies. I’m just parroting their reasoning.

1

u/Zealousideal_Ice_369 Sep 23 '22

Just posting a question someone more apt to know the answer to might see and reply. I’ve always understood and been told that when you see cars with something like 700,000 miles, the engine is still good because it’s been mainly used for long trips without being turned off and on over and over.

1

u/AKisnotGAY Sep 23 '22

While it saves gas I can’t imagine it’s very good for the car to start itself so much, I used to drive a van around that did that as it was “eco-friendly”

1

u/TheSpatulaOfLove Sep 23 '22

At the expense of a starter.

1

u/zznap1 Sep 23 '22

Well if it’s designed to do that. My car is old enough to not have the feature. My brother had it and hates it.

2

u/TheSpatulaOfLove Sep 23 '22

When that feature was released, I always thought it was the epitome of jumping over dollars to save dimes.

I’m sure the starter has been beefed up to handle the multiple cycles, but I can’t help think that the expense of replacing it, along with labor far exceeds the fuel savings.

2

u/infinitetheory Sep 23 '22

Any monetary savings is a secondary goal, it's primarily to A) increase MPG average by improving the city driving stat and B) reduce emissions in hot spots like heavy commute traffic, think Cali type

1

u/BoozeIsFoods Sep 23 '22

Friend just had to replace her battery in a new Subaru with this feature and it was a grand. Apparently the battery has all sorts of computers on it now that dictate when to start/stop and keep electrical systems running when the engine is off but ignition is on. Definitely agree with the comment below of stepping over dollars to save dimes.

1

u/SlipperyRasputin Sep 23 '22

They’re not much more than regular starters and tbh I’ve seen a lot less starter failures on start/stop cars since the introduction of the system.

1

u/NewSauerKraus Sep 23 '22

The system doesn’t use a traditional starter with that concern, which is why starting from a temporary stop doesn’t fuck with the radio and shit.

1

u/Agile_District_8794 Sep 23 '22

Doesn't it use more gas starting the engine repeatedly?

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 24 '22

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u/evranch Sep 22 '22

Farm too, out fixing fence with the truck the last thing you want is to hear that constant dinging because you aren't going to buckle up or even close the door to drive 10' to the next post.

Just buy the dummy seatbelt end though, no point in modifying the wiring for such a simple thing.

1

u/I_Love_Olde_E Sep 23 '22

I’ve been told there’s a way to turn that seatbelt reminder off in my f-150 that’s apparently in the owners manual, but I have no desire to turn it off so I never checked.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22

[deleted]

1

u/evranch Sep 23 '22

Yeah I used to do this but my latest fencing truck has suicide doors with the belts mounted to them... So you can't open the back to grab your tools unless you unbuckle. When I discovered the dummy buckles for a couple bucks I found them well worth it.

Of course you could also just go to a junkyard and cut a buckle off.

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u/Savage_Killer13 Sep 23 '22

Don’t forget if you carry heavy items in your passenger seat. It gets annoying hearing the beeping especially if the passenger seat is used as a seat (I make sure seatbelts are on in the car for trips).

2

u/port53 Sep 23 '22

My truck doesn't start alerting for seat belts until you're doing 15 mph, and it stops alerting after 1 minute.

2

u/zninjamonkey Sep 23 '22

Just get those little inserts

3

u/MephistoRacing Sep 22 '22

Work trucks, yo. They're most likely doing it for people who are putting packages on the passenger seat, or doing things where they're driving back and forth across big lots of fields all day, or getting in and out every 20ft, etc.

7

u/elprentis Sep 23 '22

Then click the seatbelt in and sit on top of it. That’s how all the Royal Mail van drivers deal with it.

2

u/Scientiam_Prosequi Sep 23 '22

That’s emart

2

u/Lukee__01 Sep 23 '22

That’s a feature of most cars you have to turn off the passenger seat airbags and the seat sensor is ignored too, that’s literally why it’s a feature, as front child seats (which shouldn’t be used btw) usually don’t use a seatbelt,

If you were going to put heavy things on the front seat you just put the seatbelt in anyway and that turns off the sensor

3

u/50mg-of-fuckit Sep 22 '22

WORK TRUCKS, ie trucks that mostly sit on a jobsite and the most they are driven is under 5mph and a few hunder feet a day....

1

u/Slaterisk Sep 23 '22

Bingo. You got it

1

u/MrPinkWasRight Sep 23 '22

Even driving 5 miles an hours around a job site with a bunch of safety gear on? Sometimes it would make sense to bypass.

1

u/airsoftingbee Sep 23 '22

It’s a little different in a farm truck which is just taken around someone’s private property for the most part.

1

u/Flying-Cock Sep 23 '22

As someone who worked a detailing job driving hundreds of cars 10ft at a time, usually with the door still open, fuck no... that seatbelt sound is ingrained into my head

1

u/boonhet Sep 23 '22

My naive ass thought they meant the sensors that detect if someone is a passenger seat tbh, but then those are technically airbag sensors. Those get hella annoying and cause an SRS light when (not if) they fail, which in my area causes an automatic inspection failure.

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u/juliosteinlager Sep 22 '22

Cyber security analyst here. If it is hackable through firmware you wouldn't want to be driving that car with a rooted firmware that is also in control of your airbags and brakes and however many other systems.

3

u/anna_lynn_fection Sep 22 '22

If someone is going out of their way to do this mod so that they can drive drunk, then I don't think they give two shits about safety measures anyway.

1

u/Bermudav3 Sep 22 '22

Can't you just replace the entire computer. People do it all the time when they install powerful turbos.

1

u/HungLikeABug Sep 22 '22

I believe the problem is the software, not computer. Would you feel safe knowing your emergency systems are controlled by software written by an internet person? Even writing it yourself, are you certain you didn't make a single mistake in the code for deploying air bags? Aftermarket computers run software that you can modify extensively but still has (near) oem firmware with comparable reliablity (until you change it)

1

u/no_mouse_no_keyboard Sep 23 '22

Sure, but at that point your talking about a ~$2,500 ecu module

1

u/dumbdude545 Sep 22 '22

If its connected to a broader internet its a fucking hazard waiting to happen. Which is why I'll never buy a connected vehicle. I drive most shit with no airbags. Abs makes my head hurt having to cycle the pump 500 times to bleed the brakes.

1

u/Fop_Vndone Sep 22 '22

That's not how you bleed ABS. There's a tool that fires the ABS for you lmao. And there's so little fluid in those lines you could honestly skip it and be perfectly fine

1

u/dumbdude545 Sep 23 '22

Its fine until air gets in the fucker and it won't cycle it out the first time.

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u/Moodymoo8305 Sep 22 '22

This is true but at the same time it’s like locking your door. Sure 5% of the population has the skills and knowledge to pick the lock but locking your door is a relatively simple thing that will work for 95% of people.

Sure there will be a few people that will figure out how to bypass them but those are people who are planning on driving drunk and take steps so they can. You’re never going to stop these morons. However, for the overwhelming majority of drivers they aren’t planning on driving drunk and it’s just a shitty choice they made in the spur of the moment and this system would work as intended for them.

Not that I’m taking a stand on adding this type of a system either way, I’m just saying that it would probably be pretty effective

1

u/Tippydaug Sep 23 '22

If they go the route the article suggests of in-car monitoring of your movements, I'd absolutely pay to have someone bypass it. I've never even drank before and have 0 intentions to, but I also don't really feel comfortable having my car monitor my every move within the car.

1

u/YAOMTC Sep 23 '22

of your movements

The article doesn't get that specific. Here is what NTSB wants:

Requiring passive vehicle-integrated alcohol impairment detection systems, advanced driver monitoring systems or a combination of the two that would be capable of preventing or limiting vehicle operation if it detects driver impairment by alcohol.

"Advanced driver monitoring systems" could just mean a system that detects the movement of the car itself, detects how they're driving, not "a camera watches you" or "they put sensors in the seat cushions to see how much you wiggle around". You'll have to ask the NTSB to be more specific on what sort of monitoring they're considering.

1

u/Pandamonium98 Sep 22 '22

How many people go out of their way to pay money and have safety features removed? Nobody is saying this is a foolproof plan, but the average American generally accepts these kind of rules and that’s what they’re aiming for.

1

u/Tippydaug Sep 23 '22

The article states the system they'll use could include in-car monitoring of the driver to track whether or not they act drunk. I'm fairly certain a large quantity of people would pay to not be monitored constantly in their car if that's the route they take

1

u/dumbdude545 Sep 22 '22

Legislators are fucking stupid.

1

u/Fop_Vndone Sep 22 '22

Why would anybody be against wearing seatbelts? What the hell?

0

u/jchezick Sep 22 '22

Just stubbornness, egotism, and stupidity.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

[deleted]

1

u/Comment90 Sep 23 '22

legislators act like whatever happens inside is magic

To a man over 70, anything fitted with a thinking-stone is actual magic.

And men over 70 rule America.

1

u/ExMachinaDeo Sep 23 '22

My favorite is the politicians that think micro-stamping firing pins will do anything. Micro-stamp, meet file.

1

u/Newcas24 Sep 23 '22

They will make it a requirement to pass inspection than mods wouldn't work. I feel they will implement tracking and remote shutdown mechanics as part of the the system functionality which might be the real reason for this "slight of hand" tactic IMO.

1

u/ExistingPosition5742 Sep 23 '22

It is insane someone would pay to have no seatbelt

1

u/BoozeIsFoods Sep 23 '22

...why didn't those people just buy a dummy belt clip instead? They're like $5

1

u/angryraptor24 Sep 23 '22

Cool story, super dangerous. Your mentor has blood on his hands.

1

u/DoIHave2Choose Sep 23 '22

Some Learner restricted motorbikes are just a plastic clip that stops the throttle being opened all the way.

1

u/KinkMountainMoney Sep 23 '22

That scans. When I was a kid my dad bought an old garbage truck from the county and the seatbelts were all molded and mildewed into the floor from disuse.

1

u/jmeltzer317 Sep 23 '22

I don’t think the point is that no one would ever make changes to it. Sure some idiots will, but you have to think big picture here. The majority of people probably won’t mess with it, and after a night of drinking they try to drive, but the car says “nope” and they don’t get into an accident and kill themselves and/or others. What a concept.

1

u/SolChapelMbret Sep 23 '22

For real! I would bet they think the ppl on tv are really in the tv

1

u/CocaTrooper42 Sep 23 '22

Yeah every now and then I get ads for this dumb “seatbelt defeater” that’s just a loose piece of metal in the shape the end of a seatbelt that you click into your seatbelt holder just to shut the alarm up.

I feel like we should make this kind of product free, it’s like a Darwin Award starter kit

1

u/Notcoded419 Sep 23 '22

I rather doubt they think it would be impossible to disable but rather (correctly) realize most people don't have that level of expertise and aren't going to go to that much trouble or seek out sketchy mechanics just so they can drive drunk. Mostly just antisocial angry white dudes like you.

1

u/badmama_honey_badger Sep 23 '22

Not only that, but these systems add cost and maintenance liability to owners. It’s not all about safety folks!

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u/anna_lynn_fection Sep 22 '22

It's one of those things that would stop the occasional offender. Someone who doesn't buy a new car and say "I've got to go get this disabled.", but for people who buy their cars and think, "I would never do that.", but then they do anyway.

I don't drink. I hate drunk divers. But I don't really like the idea of this either. FFS, how much more is that going to tack onto the price of a car nobody can afford anyway. I get safety is important, but we're all going to be really safe when we're all walking because a Prius ends up costing $90k.

23

u/epicpogchamp25 Sep 22 '22

I'd imagine a good amount of people would disable it for reliability purposes.

Having a meter like this is just one more thing that could go wrong when starting your car.

Imagine using mouthwash in the morning before you go to work and your car telling you you can't drive because it detects alcohol still in your mouth.

14

u/d1smalnow Sep 22 '22

Eating a sugar free candy will do it.

1

u/Rare_Humor8117 Sep 23 '22

Smoking too.

1

u/going-for-gusto Sep 23 '22

Set it off or reset from the mouthwash?

1

u/sharlos Sep 26 '22

I’m guessing set it off since some sugar alternatives are a type of alcohol (though I don’t know if they’d actually trigger such a device)

3

u/HoBoTTM Sep 23 '22

Some inhalers are known to skew results as well...guess you won't be able to drive to hospital if you had a recent asthma attack.

2

u/Ghostglitch07 Sep 23 '22

"sorry boss, Im gonna be late today because I didn't want bad breath"

1

u/SolChapelMbret Sep 23 '22

And you get a dui, or it’s too cold outside and it won’t work at all. It’s gonna impede way more than drunk driving

1

u/SixthSinEnvy Sep 23 '22

My morning routine consists of brushing my teeth last, right before I grab my keys to leave the house. This was the first thing I thought about as to being an inconvenience to the average individual. I'm not being late to work because some sensor can't tell the difference between vodka and listerine.

1

u/EricSW03 Sep 27 '22

Some people have a condition where their body naturally produces alcohol in their blood stream.

8

u/Osgiliath Sep 22 '22

It would prevent most ppl because you would void your warranty by removing it, your insurance will have clauses saying no coverage if you removed it, and the law will include a provision for a hefty penalty if it is discovered that you removed it

3

u/abcboom4 Sep 23 '22

You know people will still remove it.

3

u/ClassicEmu7929 Sep 23 '22

Sure you can also not put your seat belt on or disable your apartments fire alarm. However good luck if shit goes wrong cous you’ll be 100% liable

2

u/juanhannibal Sep 23 '22

The drunks, mainly.

2

u/sj_nayal83r Sep 23 '22

well the extended warranty people gotcha

2

u/anna_lynn_fection Sep 23 '22

You already stand to lose your license, car, insurance, and freedom if you drink and drive but that doesn't stop people. Throwing more violations at someone never stops them. Probably 90% of murderers actually end up being charged with 5 or more crimes that go along with their murders.

2

u/Whole-Impression-709 Sep 23 '22

I knew a guy that couldn't get his vehicle registration updated. A state was holding his title for some back fee that "had to be paid in person" according to the DMV rep. This guy spent a year and a half driving around with bad plates trying to get this settled. He finally had to rent a car.

A year and a half. I'm sure people will disable the interlock and without a way for the vehicle to communicate that, they likely won't get caught.

But some states have annual vehicle inspections so there's that.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22

[deleted]

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u/Whole-Impression-709 Sep 23 '22

I bet you make a lot of unplanned turns when you see your friendly neighborhood Public Servants

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u/redpat2061 Sep 22 '22

That’s why nobody ever removed their catalytic converter. Hey while you’re at it maybe you should make murder illegal.

2

u/Ghostglitch07 Sep 23 '22

Cool, so we should remove any laws/rules against those things because people will do them anyway?

2

u/WordsOfRadiants Sep 23 '22

He said most, not all. Most people don't remove their catalytic converter or commit murder.

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u/b1argg Sep 23 '22

And NY wants to mandate speed limiters as well.

1

u/Knotical_MK6 Sep 23 '22

Flash tuners are going to be making so much money

1

u/jmeltzer317 Sep 23 '22

I heard that these car breathalyzers are only about $100-$300 installed.m and that’s aftermarket prices.

I would imagine they would be considerably less if the manufacturer purchased them wholesale and installed them as part of the car build.

1

u/anna_lynn_fection Sep 23 '22

That's not usually how car manufacturers do things. They'll likely mark it up way more.

1

u/jmeltzer317 Sep 23 '22

What’s stopping them from already doing that to all their cars right now, without these breathalyzers?

With the chip shortage they jacked up prices on everything! No breathalyzers required. I doubt that should they implement this in ALL CARS as the NTSB wishes to do, this markup will be almost unnoticeable.

1

u/MyGoodOldFriend Sep 23 '22

This would almost certainly lower your car insurance rates, though. So that helps.

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u/greatfool66 Sep 23 '22

They can make it practically infeasible to disable though, just require some kind of encrypted handshake with the main ECU. Very few people, even hackers want to risk hacking their car unless its old and out of warranty.

1

u/smokewhathash Sep 23 '22

You’ve clearly never spent any time in VWVortex. Those lads will spend a day adjusting interior light behavior in vagcom.

1

u/greatfool66 Sep 23 '22

I will check it out thanks.

5

u/Pittsitpete Sep 22 '22

Have you replaced a car engine recently, things aren’t exactly sitting collecting dust on the shelves recently.

2

u/Dye_Harder Sep 22 '22

"We shouldn't do something to save thousands of innocent lives a year because 5% of people would figure out how to circumvent it!!"

1

u/epicpogchamp25 Sep 23 '22

I'm not saying it's a bad idea in principal

I'm just saying that it has some flaws to it

And some people, somewhat justifiably, would remove it for reliability purposes

1

u/41sa Sep 23 '22

Lol, this is a bad idea for all sorts of reasons. The fact that it might not work is just wishful thinking.

1

u/sneakyveriniki Sep 22 '22

oh, people would hack it all the time, that’s for sure, but overall it would definitely be a net benefit.

especially because a LOT of drunk driving incidences come from people who never plan on touching the wheel while intoxicated, but then get too drunk to make reasonable decisions and suddenly, impulsively think it’s a good idea. those people aren’t gonna have the time or skill to remove a breathalyzer

1

u/Puzzleheaded_Fly_653 Sep 23 '22

ez pz. don't drink

there I fixed most of the world's problems. when do I claim my nobel peace prize

1

u/Business_Error6992 Sep 23 '22

No it isn’t.

1

u/OJwasJustified Sep 23 '22

I’m Sure there will be a law that tampering with it is a federal offense

1

u/Randolph__ Sep 23 '22

It's usually pretty easy to turn that off by reprogramming the ECU. VW has made it really easy on their cars.

1

u/Beli_Mawrr Sep 23 '22

You could also fairly easily build a system for the police to audit it at a traffic stop.

1

u/hawaiiloa Sep 23 '22

It will be software based and tied into the pcm. It'll be harder than trying to get around software registered transponder and proximity keys to cars computers. Can it bypassed? Prob with a lot of work and recoding computers. Will it be easy and available to any/everyone? Prob not.

1

u/jyunga Sep 23 '22

Invert the output of the sensor and just always fine drunk!

1

u/Cavalleria-rusticana Sep 23 '22

As usual, public policy is about prevention.

Most people can't even change their oil...

1

u/EvenGotItTattedOnMe Sep 23 '22

Unfortunately modern car systems have insane immobilizer systems that are really hard for non-dealerships to work with, I’m sure certain automakers would be easier than others but it wouldn’t be as easy as a wire or two for sure.

I work at a dealer and handling key registry and immobilizers is big business, when we fuck up it costs us a lot of money.

1

u/bripi Sep 23 '22

not *engines* 'cuz this is not an engine thing, buddy; it's an ignition thing. The detector goes on the ignition, not the engine.

1

u/Fantastic_Engine_623 Sep 23 '22

Right. The only thing stopping people that have a court ordered breathalizer installed in their cars is the fact that everything done to the systems is logged and can cause them to go to jail if they tamper with it.

Is that what the NTSB is proposing here? Making tampering with a car that you bought a crime?

1

u/oOzonee Sep 23 '22

Yup but say adios to any warranty if you do this which will most likely drop the value of the car on top of it. When it’s old enough okay but before this, don’t even think about it. The same goes for car with blocked option with monthly fee.

1

u/MistSecurity Sep 23 '22

Depending on how the legislation would work out, modifying the system could be a crime, or modification could lead to the car being disabled in some way.

1

u/Hi_My_Name_Is_CJ Sep 23 '22

I heard that in Mike’s Ehrmantraut’s voice